recently I purchased a cheap card, that was labelled as “near mint”
the photos of the card were taken at a certain angle, and I bought the item.
when it arrived, I now see that if you hold it at a different angle, it has damage on the back.
I know this isn’t a big deal or anything, since it is a cheap card, but it’s kind of bothering me.
this has happened to me a number of times now, and up until now I have just taken these situations as a loss.
I personally, state every defect of every card I sell. and when someone purchases it, I message them before sending it out making sure they are aware of the defects.
I understand that isn’t how everyone works, but I feel like it should be…
how do you guys sell cards? do you keep it 100 or “mislabel” things in your favor when necessary?
also, do you think I should do something about it?
again, it’s a cheap card (7$) with free shipping. but it’s the principle that bothers me.
The damage on this card has rendered it pretty much toilet paper.
I wouldn’t care much for a 7 usd card just eat it. But when these things downgrade the value for hundreds of dollars, then there’s a big issue. Just keep the card in a binder so you never see it’s back, idk.
yeah that’s what I’ve been doing up until now.
but now I have like a full page of cards that are worthless. and it does add up to a decent sum of money that I am now missed out on.
I feel like we should stop just letting people get away with it, so it stops happening as much in the future
Contact the seller, maybe they will be willing to give you a refund.
When I buy a cheap card and that happens to me I’ll see what the seller says. If they fix the issue great, if not then don’t buy from them again and move on.
Most honest sellers would give you a refund in that scenario. Could be possible they just missed it and didn’t look at it closely enough if you have to hold it in a certain light to see.
@vampire_x Honestly I feel your pain. The same situations happen to me often. At first I just reordered the card and took it as a loss. After about a dozen times I became somewhat of a dick about it. If I recieve a creased or dented card i offer to pay about 20 percent of purchase price and the rest refunded. Or return the card. With them paying return shipping as well. Creased cards should be labeled as damaged. Same with dented. PSa won’t grade these cards higher than a 5 or 6 which prevents them from being anywhere close to near mint. Assuming there isn’t also back whitening or hidden scratches. Sellers should never hide damage. Or you get cards with 4-6 plus whitening spots labeled as near mint. That’s more like light played. Near mint/mint you should at least have a shot for PSa 7 or better. I feel all cards should be labeled in one of three categories. Mint. Light played. And Damaged/Heavy played. There is no need for near mint listings or moderate played. Just my thoughts. Sorry for rant but I feel the frustration.
I totally know how you feel. Happened to me time and time again. I’ve gotten pretty good at returns on eBay lol. Bought a few holo base cards listed as NM to complete a set and they are just in horrible shape. I wouldn’t even list as lightly played. Multiple heavy scratches and massive amounts of whitening. I think people need to describe what “NM” means to them when listing in that condition because it seems like such a joke these days.
I don’t think general population understands the grading system well. Looking at a card that’s 20 years old for example with a few light scratches and small whiting on edges is probably ‘near mint’ to someone who’s looking at a card and thinking about how much more damaged it could be.
Having said that, taking photos to hide the blemishes is unethical. You could always note the item as ‘not as described’ and look to get your money back. Probably not worth it over $7 but for larger ones
Contact them and let them know. They’ll probably offer a full/partial refund. If they don’t, give them negative/neutral feedback.
I sell on eBay, and (not to pay myself on the back, but…) I’m basically one of the few highly accurate and conservative graders on there. I know of exactly one other seller who has consistently sent me correctly graded cards. I make a point of not buying from sellers who do any of the following:
Distinguish between ‘NM’ and ‘mint.’ There’s no such thing as a mint card. If a seller has both of these grades, their NM will probably be PSA 7 or worse (in my experience).
Take photos on a white background and/or at angles that are clearly taken to disguise wear.
State something along the lines of ‘sold as-is’ and/or ‘absolutely no returns’ in the description. This is almost always an attempt to cover one’s ass. It doesn’t actually do anything, of course — but it suggests this intention.
Ultimately, the Pokémon hobby suffers from pathetically lax grading standards. This does NOT have to be the case. It’s not the case in MTG. There are plenty of MTG sellers who are loose graders — but, largely, people know how to fairly grade cards. Pokémon has a stark lack of strict, conservative, and accurate graders. Don’t purchase from sellers who grade loosely or employ dishonest listing tactics — it just reinforces those behaviors. I make a point of almost exclusively buying from certain sellers. There are a couple TCGplayer vendors, namely, who are highly accurate graders. Figure out who these people are and support them — positively reinforce the behaviors of honest and fair sellers.
Sorry for the rant, but my point is that you should consider contacting the seller and politely informing them of the condition discrepancy. It may have been an honest mistake (though probably not), and they should be given a chance to make it right. But if they don’t, give them negative/neutral feedback. Negatively reinforce their dishonest practices.
@zorloth That’s another point I wanted to make. A lot of sellers that sell under near mint the card comes with best case senerio being a Psa 7 and a high chance of it being lower. Why can’t they at least aim for 8 quality or better. That way if there is something overlooked it might still be Psa 7 quality. Or simply grade the cards before selling if you know it’s a certain grade. I feel like sellers list near mint cards they personally would never grade themselves… So the question is are they truly near mint? (Obviously some sellers have good quality standards but it seems the majority don’t. Maybe 5 percent of sellers know what near mint even is
What do you mean by damage? I use PSA’s scale on eBay for card condition and PSA consider “near mint” as PSA 7. I had someone on eBay recently ask for a refund because a card I’d listed had small patches of whitening around the border on the back (enough for it to not qualify as a PSA 10, but certainly not enough to bring it down lower than PSA 8 in my mind).
I sell cards as mint if they were something I’d pulled out of a pack and put straight into protection, although the only cards I ever sell as mint are cards which aren’t worth money grading - if they’re $5 raw and $25 in PSA 9 it’s a no-brainer to spend $8 getting them graded.
Yup, this exactly reflects my experience. And it’s why the holos I’ve been acquiring for my sets as of late are predominantly PSA 8/9s that I crack. Even PSA 8s, in my experience, are hit or miss. Older cert 8s are typically EX condition, though some are nice.
Almost no sellers have fair grading standards. Since I’ve already bought all that I needed from them, I’ll give a shout-out to Graded Power. One of a handful of TCGPlayer vendors who have working eyesight lol. Personally, I have almost 1500 active listings and not a single card graded higher than NM. No NM/M or mint. I’m sure not overgrading hurts my sales, but I don’t want to be part of the problem. But I’m not going to lie and say that it isn’t tempting to overgrade. If I was relying on eBay for a living, I probably WOULD overgrade. Since it’s a hobby and selling isn’t critical for me, I don’t. So I can empathize with many of the sellers who overgrade. But it’s still unfortunate that this is how it is.
And, as you’ve pointed out, PSA grading seems to have caused (or at least contributed to) the loose grading standards of this hobby. People like to PSA grade everything in sight. So now the raw cards you find are either consistently sub-8 or priced the same as graded copies. Especially for holos. Definitely less of an issue for non-holos, and probably also for modern cards, though.
@zorloth That’s strange I never seen that seller yet. And yes I feel like they over grade to get the maximum price for a ungradeable card. But have no interest in giving actual mint cards. I’m sure those get graded by just about all these sellers. When I buy near mint I don’t expect a perfect card but it’s annoying that most are light played or worse. I don’t even take centering into consideration which I know is a factor in the grade. I simply count the flaws. A card with 4 plus whitening marks has zero chance of even a 7. Correct me if I’m wrong but my PSa 6 doesn’t even have a drop of whitening. It has one heavy scratch. But as far as I’m aware 3 whitening spots should be PSa 7 material. More flaws has to be even lower.
+1 on leaving feedback. Whether or not you get a refund, item was not as described. It will make future buyers a bit more cautious with this seller. I believe this is the best way to get sellers to list as accurately as possible over time.
@zorloth I can’t say I can echo your experience. Most of my PSA 10 Pichus are cards I’ve graded myself after buying “NM/MT” copies on eBay. I’ve sent in probably around 200 Pichu cards to PSA that have been acquired this way and I’ve only had 1 PSA 7 grade and around 10 PSA 8 grades - the vast majority have been PSA 9 or PSA 10.
I wonder if it’s location based? I’m in the UK and predominantly buy from European sellers to avoid customs charges.
If you’re buying off a ton of random sellers maybe they are better about condition in your area. Or maybe you have a excellent eye. Or incredibly lucky or a combination of all 3. Sometimes I feel like I get better condition cards when I don’t see the picture. A lot of the time the near mint eBay listings look flawless but come with a lip in the corner not shown. Or baby crease’s. Sometimes huge crease. Or 4-5 plus whitening areas. When I buy off the list i have of trusted sellers everything is fine. It’s when I take a gamble on a new person is when I usually run into trouble. And i know this thread says cheap cards. But this happens with $5 cards thru $200 plus. So the bad cards start to add up. Plus while you bought the bad listing a better option sold off the market. Availability is a major issue on some cards ungraded.
You probably haven’t seen them because I’ve very nearly bought them out. It’s the only reason I’m even mentioning them publicly. There are a few other strict sellers who still have inventory left, and I fully intend on stating who they are once I’m completely done purchasing all that I need from them. Graded Power is much more of an MTG seller, though, so their Pokémon inventory wasn’t all that extensive in the first place.
And I think you’re slightly off on your expectations, unless ‘whitening dot’ means something different to you. I take it you’re referring to the tiny white specks on the back border that are often on cards straight from the pack? If so, a card can certainly have more than 3 and still be a PSA 8. If you’re talking about whitening that is more immediately visible, then I think you’re generally correct. Except PSA 7 cards are pretty bad, and definitely worse than you’re thinking. Many PSA 7s have consistent edge wear. If a card has an indent/crease, then it’s automatically less than a 7, though. Although the first PSA 8 FRLG Charizard ex I cracked had a giant dent in it lol. So it doesn’t always hold true.
Yeah, it could be location-based. I’m in the US and almost never buy from international sellers. It also could be because I’ve only been back into the hobby since late last year. It sounds like you’re referring to cards you purchased 1+ year(s) ago (because you’ve gotten them back from PSA lol). If I had to guess, the quality of raw cards on the market has declined significantly since even one or two years ago.
Admittedly I haven’t done this in over a year now, you’re right. I guess also Pichu is a very specific Pokémon which most people don’t care at all about - if you’re buying popular cards I can imagine running into this problem a lot.
Every card is different but generally I’m not talking about a small dot. It’s usually quite noticeable spots. And when I buy light played whitening isn’t a issue unless it’s one of those cards that the entire back is whitening around the entire card. It’s hard to describe without a picture but you know what I mean. One that looks like it was scrapped along the pavement almost lol @zorloth
(Obviously some sellers have good quality standards but it seems the majority don’t. Maybe 5 percent of sellers know what near mint even is