I’ve went through some of the previous topics and I know people have mixed feelings about those that are here to “invest” and I totally understand.
I’m kind of stuck. I want to invest in Pokemon but really dont know where to start. Is investing in singles a good move without being graded? Is graded my only option? I know these sound silly but I’m just a little lost.
I’ve been collecting for a long time and been a fan even longer. I’ve been trying to do my research on more graded cards as I would like to lock some up now that the pandemic era of prices are gone from two years ago, but I was wondering if maybe some people could help. (I totally understand if not)
I’ve noticed a couple things in my recent time back and while on here Please correct me if I seem wrong:
-Dont always have to buy a 10 if you can only afford a 9
-JP Cards seem to be up right now? Not sure if all or just promos
-Prices wont be back to covid era for a while
-US prices are a little wonky due to flippers/FOMO at times
-Illustrators matter on cards? COuld be wrong here
Overall, I feel like “investing” in Pokemon boils down to collecting what you like, but I’ve noticed small things like people obviously liking Pikachu more than others, or 1st Ed is better than Unlimited. Maybe I’m just curious how other people are approaching it.
Sorry for this post being all over the place, hopefully there is a general feel of what Im asking
But actually…I think efour is one of the best places to ask for advice no matter the topic area! Its much less toxic here (if at all) than places like reddit, facebook, instagram, etc from my experience. I think the reason for that is efour is largely filled with people who see Pokemon as a hobby first, investment second. Many people here do both, but at the core, we all love Pokemon cards.
It sounds cliché, but I think the best advice is to buy what you like. Chances are, someone else likes it too.
You said it yourself.
Theres really too much to boil it down into one post, so I’ll just give some advice I found to be good and then others can offer their own insights.
One BIG tip is that the card market for Pokemon is very diverse. There are many, many, many subcategories and sections of the hobby that have little to no impact on one another. There’s opportunity everywhere. If investing is your goal, I would try and find areas that you are both passionate about and you see some opportunity in (others will like the cards too).
The reason I say this is that its hard to buy something you don’t care for. You are more likely to sell it as soon as the prices move and can end up missing some opportunities because of it.
No need to apologize. We are here to think this through with you.
Consider your answers to the five questions below:
Do you have an emergency fund?
Do you have a 401(k), pension, or another retirement account that you’re actively contributing to?
Do you own property?
Are you in debt (including student loans)?
Are you taking care of your health/well-being?
These are not prerequisites to enjoy collectibles or to make money in Pokemon. However, they highlight five areas of one’s life that should be prioritized when “going all in” to the collectible market or any alternative asset (Debt, Emergency, Health, Property, Retirement).
If you feel confident in your answers to these questions, then I would think about whether your goal is to sell short-term or long-term. Many sellers nowadays make their money by chasing hype and the flavor of the week. It can be a risky business when the market turns on you. Others like to hold onto cards that they believe have good fundamentals (e.g., out-of-print cards, rarer cards, cards in gem mint or mint condition).
In both situations, I would recommend buying cards that you like and that you believe in. There’s nothing worse than buying something to sell in the future that you have absolutely no attachment to or interest in (looking at you, closet cases of McDonald’s 25th anniversary promos). Generally, graded or sealed cards are easier to sell than raw cards.
HYSA, bonds, or cds are at a guaranteed ~5%. invest in broad funds if you have a longer time horizon. invest in pokemon if you want to lose money. this is financial advice.
Big price differences between 9s and 10s on modern. 9 is basically a raw card, 10 is what people care about. 9s will not appreciate as highly as 10s due to that.
Japanese cards are up since there is printing issues going on in Japan. Wouldnt speculate on cards during a production shortage since they can just do reprints and then you lose money. I dont think they will go back and reprint the last few japanese sets but its not really a good thing to bet on since you have no control over that.
Nobody knows where prices will be but one thing is for sure is that theres not going to be a bunch of government money like there was during the pandemic so less likely things will explode in growth like they did.
I dont even know what you mean by wonky pricing that seems very vague.
Illustration Rares are just Alternative Arts but now has its own rarity and yes people like fancy looking cards.
Speculating is just gambling. Dont do that. Buy Pokemon cards if you want them for your own collection, but if you want to make money off them it involves reselling and flipping. Buying cards and just hoping they are worth more than what you paid today is not a very strong strategy since you dont know what people will be into years down the road. Maybe Pokemon is dead 20 years from now. Probably not but then again nobody predicted it would have lasted as long as it did. Just learn how to resell stuff if you wanna make money since its a safer bet.
Building on what @Dyl said, which is great advice, my question for you is:
Are you looking to invest? Or to collect Pokemon cards? Because if you’re going to collect what you like, when the time comes when you want or need to spend that money, it is going to be painful to sell.
It can go something like this. Let’s say you like Snorlax (based on your avatar). You start out with the easy ones, all the normal modern set cards and vintage unlimited holos, some foreign language Snorlax, some fun error card Snorlaxes. Then you start wanting 1st ed vintage holos and high grade slabs… I have no idea what a PSA 10 Skyridge Snorlax costs but I’m sure it ain’t cheap. Maybe there are a couple cards that take you years to search for and finally acquire. You now have an awesome Snorlax binder and display case. You’ve spent a few thousand dollars, and maybe over the years it’s appreciated to be worth a thousand or two more. But now it’s time to buy a house and you want to make a 10% deposit on the house without blowing your entire savings account or dipping into retirement accounts (which should be a precursor to even thinking about investing in Pokemon cards). Are you going to be ready to sell this “investment” without a second thought? If you have to think about it for more than a second, this is a hobby collection, not an investment.
*I’m not a financial advisor, this is just my opinion, hope it helps.
I would say investing in cards and reselling/flipping cards are two totally different ballgames.
Investing is almost entirely passive and hardly requires any sort of dedicated time commitment. Flipping, on the other hand, is much more active and much more of a grind, as you have to scour different platforms for good bulk deals or cards under market price while also competing with others doing the same.
Each has their own pros and cons, but for someone expressing interest in investing in cards, going the flipper route may not be a good alternative.
Investing in trading cards is absolutely not passive by any means since at some point you have to sell and then your in the same spot as someone reselling/flipping. Its not like stocks where you just go on etrade and click a button and get paid. Sure you can send your stuff to consignment but that means you have less control over how much you end up getting on it if you just end up dumping it into auction.
You can move graded cards fairly easily but when it comes to sealed, no way. That stuff is way harder to move if you want the most money possible. Your going to have to go to a bunch of trade shows and deal with a bunch of ebay bs just to get rid of it for its full market value.
Good points to keep in mind, but wouldn’t it still be considered passive (or mostly passive)? The point that makes it passive is that, as your portfolio is increasing in cost, you are not exerting any additional effort. I agree though that the liquidity and selling backend of things should not be overlooked.
Again, relative to flipping, your effort input is going to be way less. If you want to flip and be making profit at a good rate (whatever you deem that to be), you have to constantly be on the lookout for deals (and constantly selling at the same time). The churn and burn of flipping is going to require more effort than the buy-and-wait-ten-years tactic.
The overall point was that someone looking to buy and sit on inventory is not always going to have the time to go through the daily grind of flipping. Maybe OP is okay with it, but just making the point that flipping is not a direct substitute for investing if you’re looking to make some money off of Pokemon cards.
Its the same exact process of flipping except that your delaying the work for X amount of years. Nothing about it is passive at all since its not just about buying the cards. You still have to know how to sell the cards. The cards are not just going to evaporate and you will have money in your bank account. And it gets even harder if you try to scale “investing” since the more boxes you get, the more storage you need which comes with maintaining that. You can some weight off by storing cards in vaults, but then you gotta pay for vaults and manage the inventory on the vaults, so no nothing about it is passive in any capacity.
Not to mention you will always have increases in postage, fuel costs, storage costs, fees on websites, inflation, etc. Even if your cards go up, so will all of these costs, so its alot more complicated than it looks.
In my mind, passive income doesn’t mean no effort is required at all. Yes, you have to still sell the items you acquire, but compared to flipping, the amount of selling you’ll have to do is relatively low. You aren’t only delaying the work, but minimizing it, as you won’t need to be selling every day to keep the profit/cash flow running. And again, your inventory would be appreciating (i.e. you’d be increasing potential wealth) without any additional effort.
Consider rental income. I think most would consider rental income to be passive income (maybe you don’t agree). It doesn’t mean you don’t need to put in any work at all to collect your rental money. You need to find renters, maintain the property, due your due diligence in acquiring permits and whatever, etc. You can minimize much of this by getting a property manager, but I could argue that a vault/storage facility+consigner combination would basically be the “property manager” for investing in cards: you pay a fee to another person/service to minimize the time and effort you need to put in to capture your capital. Yes, they come at a cost, but in the end, if your investments have appreciated, you’d still be collecting a profit.
Anyways, I think we’ve both put our points out there. Maybe we can just agree to disagree (as we have slightly derailed the thread)
Edit: Not sure if passive income was the best term to use, but I hopefully got my point across anyway.
I think your referring more to mental labor vs hard labor than anything. This isnt really a matter of income being passive or not, which one requires work today vs work in the future. Your still going to be on the hook for getting rid of all those booster boxes, etbs, and premium collections in the future and those boxes are HEAVY. Like compared to graded cards, your going to be doing some heavy lifting just to ship them from point A to point B or hiring someone to get rid of them for you.
The issue with any sort of TCG “investing” is that you just cant predict the future. None of us knew that this stuff was still going to be around for 20+ years (and anyone saying different is just lying to themselves). There may not be a return in the future. Today you can make the money, tomorrow, you really dont know. There are risks and its not as easy as people make it out to be.
Good points. Admittedly, for whatever reason, when I think of more serious investing in the TCG, my mind turns to graded cards/vintage sealed product (of which, your inventory is going to be a lot lower) and not modern sealed product. I agree that investing in things like modern sealed product is rife with potential complications, and lots of people are wanting to be the next Alpha Investments without understanding that that business model is not going to work for 99% of people.
I’m overall with you about the dangers of investing in the TCG. It’s a risk–like any investment would be. But it seems like, these days, the complications and risks are downplayed or not well thought through/presented.
And I now see where you’re coming from regarding flipping–basically guaranteeing you can capture some profit immediately.
There’s honestly a lot to learn in this hobby if you’re approaching it with any type of investor mindset. It’s good to know more than less about any card/sets you want to collect. Basically, what makes it a great collectible/card? Is it popular with strong demand or low demand? Did it have a limited/unique release? Do people like the artwork? Etc. It takes time to learn, and so it’s best to just spend some time reading and thinking out why you want to buy any given card (especially anything expensive/rare).
With slabs, 9s and 10s are generally most attractive to investor types. People like mint or better cards generally in my experience. However, there’s plenty of raw card collectors as well who build binder or toploader sets. Personally, I like having a mix of high graded slabs and raw NM cards. In addition, you can generally get a lot more quantity of NM cards which allows you to build your collection faster. With raw cards, you’re still invested in the market in some way as well. There’s many levels and price points to collect at.
With all this, it’s good to have some goals. I like to document things to some extent and set short and long-term goals. For example, I’ll try and make a list of cards I want to get this year or eventually buy later on. With most cards you’ll always have a chance to buy them at any point, so it’s best to have a long-term approach to the hobby. No need to FOMO usually.
As far as Japanese vs English collecting, that’s also a huge thing to unravel. Both will move in different directions for a variety of reasons. I didn’t like Japanese as much when I got back into the hobby, but the longer I’ve been in it, they’ve grown on me a lot. There’s a lot of unique cards in Japanese, especially promos and things.
Anyway, starting out I would just focus on setting a budget and collecting things you’re genuinely interested in. Over time, you’ll probably broaden your approach and explore more. There’s just so much to explore and keep track of, so it’s worth taking your time with it starting out.
Yeah im aware of the rudy the magic guy from youtube and while he seems like a fine fella, the advice he gives can be very misleading since he is in the business of trying to turn over as much product as possible. Ive been in the card flipping business since the early 2000s and from what Ive watched about rudy, he is just trying to get as many people to buy from him to get higher allocations of better products from distribution since that is literally the only way to actually sell any tcg in high numbers since nobody would buy that much product otherwise.
Also as someone who has done alot of sales on ebay, yeah good luck unloading lol. eBay will literally drop your IQ points from dealing with people on there. You can move the stuff via some auction house (PWCC, Goldin, Heritage, etc) or consignment (probstein, various random youtubers), but your basically running a warehouse still inbetween that time. To hold as much product as rudy has, you literally need a commercial warehouse. And on a smaller scale, its still going to eat up lots of space in wherever you live. I think too many people are trying to copy Rudy not realizing how his business really works. Also Rudy has the luxury of having a strong client base on Patron, which nobody else really has and takes work to build a client base of buyers with deep pockets to unload stuff to.
(as we have slightly derailed the thread)