Hi, I was hoping we could have a discussion on Paypal Friends and Family payments, specifically on accepting friends and family payments when you are a seller.
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I mean youâre right, but nobody here thought that F&F is safe to begin with.
Edit: Thanks for the scam instructions though.
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Thereâs no need in all of these, you can just call your bank and say that thereâs an unauthorized charge. Bank will remove it and you will lose your money. I had this happened to me.
F&F chargebacks are certainly real. I disagree that this is âeasierâ to do than a G&S scam and by your instructions it also requires the buyer to enter the transaction with ill intent so youâre still somewhat protected against buyerâs remorse for instance. I think itâs valuable for people to understand there will always be some risk in transactions, I think there is less value in explaining the exact steps you can do to scam someone.
Iâd still argue for the most part F&F is a safer route for the seller (until your paypal account is banned). You didnât offer any alternatives so I donât know how helpful this thread is except as a how-to guide for scammers
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Alternative:
- Increase price of the item by 3%
- Send goods and service Invoice
- Enjoy your paypal protection
The ONLY way that youâre gonna get scammed is if the buyer pulls a switcharoo when returning the item, and if they do, you should go to the police station and file a report.
PP Is gonna see that you sold 100 things and this is the first time something like this happened and look at the police report you provide and theyâre gonna look at the buyerâs account who is either his first transaction or he bought 11 things and pulled some shit like this 10 times.
The old switcheroo is the only method to scam someone through goods and service who follows all the rules.
The only other way you can get scammed is if the buyer says âNo no no, I need this sent to my cousin as a gift, hereâs his addressâ
As @pkmnflyingmaster says scammers will scam. Nearly all people who try and scam me on eBay end up âwinningâ and getting the item and their money back. The thing is I have a good history and relationship with eBay so for small amounts they just refund the buyer out of their own pocket. This system can clearly be gamed by anyone willing to team up with a friend and game it from both ends. Same goes for Paypal G&S. If/when this happens with larger amounts usually the threat of law enforcement involvement stifles any issues.
If you fight back against a chargeback in this instance you will likely lose, but the credit card processor will get note of that and buyers canât just continually charge back otherwise the card issues will stop taking them on. Especially when they are fought with some evidence.
From the sellers end I guess the best defense in this situation would be to say you didnât realize they sent it as Fnf and show documentation of the transaction and shipment and go from there. A relationship with paypal could help in this instance, but not sure how it would all go. Similarly if I sell something for $10k goods and services and the buyer claims empty box then it becomes a he said she said and you could theoretically lose.
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Only use F&F with people who are either your family⌠or friends!
Crazy!
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Honestly, the most likely outcome is theyâre gonna take a look at your paypal account, see that youâve been accepting friends and family payments left and right from people, gets suspicious, and then ban you, ban your IP, and ban any future accounts you try to make under your name and youâll be stuck using your baby momaâs paypal account until you eventually get that banned to.
Friends and Family doesnât provide any address so itâs gonna be a HARD sell to claim that you didnât notice that the address was missing.
Youâre only chance of not getting banned is if itâs like your first transaction ever, then itâs plausible that you didnât notice the address was missing. But theyâre still gonna give your money back to the buyer and then put you on a watch list.
Lol never seen anyone say f&f is safe on the contrary most advise against it.
Very interesting, thx for the info
@karmaawhoree 95%+ all of my transactions on paypal are goods and services and 90%+ of my friends and family transactions are actually non sale friends and family transfers so I personally am pretty sure Iâd be set. My overall Paypal activity has gone down significantly though since eBay started managing my payments. I could honestly live without Paypal if I needed to.
Iâm not arguing against any of your points, just putting some more thoughts out there. Iâve posted a lot on this forum about the issues (both moral and functional) with using FF transfers for the sale of goods. Taxes should be paid on all profits, fees should be paid to any service you utilize and the terms of service should be followed for all as well.
Yeah, I agree. You seem like a good poster and Iâm a shit poster so thanks for humoring me.
My biggest problem isnât with paypal not getting paid, itâs that for a lot of people, they are investing in pokemon cards.
Can you imagine if you sold part of your stock portfolio and you got scammed?
âSorry little timmy, you donât get to go to college, I wanted to save 100$ on paypal feesâ
At this point in the market and who is buying and selling these cards there are legit people out there whoâs lives would be changed if they got scammed.
I think this community is really great and I feel protective of itâs members and I donât want to see anyone getting screwed.
A lot of people are buying 10,000$ cards so they can try to sell them for 11,000$ and 1,000$ is a lot of money to these people nevermind 10,000$.
Could you imagine spending 10 big ones on something you expected to make money from and then bam- youâre in the poorhouse?
Yeah I mean itâs designed for friends and family. Itâs certainly not safe, nor intended beyond that. The paypal fees is not just a bs tax; itâs to give you protection. And you have to pay for that.
Interesting. Just anecdotally in my experience FF payers are a lot less skittish, meanwhile regular GS/ebay buyers sometimes want a refund if it doesnât arrive within a week, if they missed something in the picture and what not. Guess it has to do with the perception that FF is less reversible than it actually is?
So for those honest customers of yours, they have no hope of getting their money back, so theyâre just like âthank god this guy actually sent somethingâ so they are not gonna bug you if it takes a day or two longer to show up.
G/S people know they can get their money back any time they want so theyâre more pushy, because they have the power. They can start a return anytime they want, and send whatever they want back to you, and theyll get their money, paypal will pay for their return shipping, itâs on a silver platter for them
F/F is only a problem if the guy is planning on screwing you from the start. A lot of people will join reddit, facebook, sell a couple of 10$ cards for 6 or 7 dollars, get a few feedback, and then once they have a few feedback, they buy a 1st ed Charizard with for friends and family.
Wait. You can get money back if you pay FF?!!!
Only reason I ask. I typically will NOT use it. To buy. I was always to nervous about getting scammed by a seller. If this is the case Iâll use it more knowing I actually have protection.
I have tried to buy from people in the past who wonât use GS even if I pay fees, taxes is always the reason Iâm given.
This thread is so dangerous.
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Lol, I can see how it could be.
Iâm just pissed on a few cards I passed on thinking the risk wasnât worth it.
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You can only get your money back FF if you are a crook using a VPN.
âI have tried to buy from people in the past who wonât use GS even if I pay fees, taxes is always the reason Iâm given.â
Those guys were trying to scam you dude