I have mentioned this before and MANY people have agreed with my understanding that the relationship between conditions could be summed up as follows…
BGS 10>PSA10>BGS9.5>PSA9>BGS9=PSA8
It is totally fine if you do not agree with this, but I find this usually is pretty accurate. My question is in regards to BGS9 and PSA8. Now, a 9 is greater than an 8, but they seem to typically be around the same condition.
**Would you value a BGS 9 as more, less or the same as a PSA 8? WHY?**To provide context, we all know Base Set 1st edition prices have skyrocketed. I have the starters (Zard, Blastoise and Venusaur) as strong 8’s in PSA 8 and I love them. As a collector, I love that my prized cards have value too, so I’m questioning if it would be reasonable to attempt a cross to BGS for a possible 9 regardless if it is weak or strong.
For the record, I do understand the idea of buying the card and not the grade. I’m very happy with my cards as they are, but I’m also an average guy that can’t ignore the potential value in my property. Personally, I like PSA more than BGS, but it’s hard to ignore price differences. I also wish prices would decline so I can simply buy more, but who knows if that will happen, right?
First of all, it depends on the sub-grades of the BGS card. For example, a BGS 9 with sub-grades of 10/9.5/9/9 is likely better than the average PSA 8. However, if any of the sub-grades are below a 9, then yeah it should roughly correlate to PSA 8 quality on average.
Secondly, I think your general observation is true - there are many new collectors to the hobby now, and many of them seem to have the idea that a PSA 9 and a BGS 9 are the same thing, so BGS 9s are selling for closer to PSA 9s than they are to PSA 8s.
As a collector, I am sticking with PSA.
But if my goal were to flip for profit, and I had a card that I thought was unlikely to grade as a PSA 10, I would probably grade with BGS to maximize flipping gains.
I mean personally it all depends on the subs. Like if a card was a BGS 9 with centering 9, edges 9, corners 9.5, and surface 9.5, I’d probably consider it as a PSA 9. Our individual opinions don’t really matter though, it’s the market’s opinion that matters, and the market as of now has decided that BGS 9s(even with subs that indicate that they’re probably PSA 8s, aka 8.5 surface) are worth more than PSA 8s.
@madden12ut,That is exactly what I am seeing and I see a huge difference sometimes too. Another great example is the 1st ed Neo genesis Lugia. I have a Minty PSA 8, but it has the evil factory lines. I see BGS 9’s listed for 3k, which is a huge difference over the PSA 8 and they all have the 8.5 surface. I’m not sure honestly if anyone is getting 3k, but I think it is more than the PSA 8 value regardless.
I agree with your first point but I feel like I keep seeing sales that indicate buyers are buying off the overall grade more than the sub grades. We as collectors care, but I’m not sure people just jumping in have that same knowledge or desire. I would be interested to see where the market is at in 6 months.
Will things even out between a PSA 8 and BGS 9 or will BGS 9 keep getting a premium regardless of subs?
@joer, a BGS 9 lugia auctioned at $4k and the PWCC BGS 9 lugia is basically at $4k as well, pretty big difference between the PSA 8 pricing indeed. I have sometimes seen BGS slip a print line neo gen card a 9 surface, permitting the card to get a gem mint 9.5 grade as well. Definitely worth cracking and grading it with beckett if you want to maximize your selling price imo
I was talking about comparing the strength of a BGS 9 to a PSA 8.
I agree that sub-grades seem to make very little difference in terms of the prices BGS cards receive, which is funny because the sub-grades make a big difference in terms of the quality of the card. BGS 9.5s with 10/10/9.5/9.5 sub-grades and BGS 9.5s with 9.5/9.5/9.5/9 are very different, but the sales prices don’t seem to reflect that. Of course, the same thing could be said with “strong PSA X” grades and “weak PSA X” grades, so it is what it is (people buying the label).
Entirely dependent on subgrades, which are dependent on one’s personal preference. I don’t believe in forcing a universal standard on every grading company of what could cross.
@hyruleguardian ,My issue with BGS has always been the inconsistancy with what they deem 9-9.5 and 10. You get all the evidence you need just from watching Leonhart grade with BGS every week. One day he gets 9 centering and then the next they give him 10 centering and he sits there saying he doesn’t understand how the sub grades make sense. I’ve also seen the same thing with the corners and edges, just very inconsistent sometimes. I get the feeling there is literally no difference sometimes between 9.5-10 sometimes.
Edit: I will say I like how BGS looks. They look very professional and protected.
Based on recent sales, the subgrades don’t seem to matter actually. The BGS 9 seems to be beating the PSA 8 price even with 8.5 surface. The proof is in those Lugia’s mentioned.
Sheldons mum from Big Bang Theory pops up in my head every time he says it.
I am starting to find his fake excitement on every pull a tad draining these days, especially as he’s had some mega pulls like that 1st Char and in the next video hes showing the same excitement pulling a Butterfree Vmax
I’m friends with someone who actively buys mid-tier PSA graded cards, cracks them, then submits to Beckett. Not only have the cards got bumped up every time he’s done it (10 plus times now) one was a PSA 6 shadowless zard that got a BGS 9. I realize this is a small sample size but just seeing this first hand… I do not put much trust in Beckett at all.
@hyruleguardian,Hence the reason for this discussion… I wonder if you would get similar results if you tried crossing with a review in the original case. My gut tells me no, but who knows. Hard to argue when the difference is in thousands of dollars.
For what it’s worth, I’ve cracked many psa 8’s (all first edition shadowless), obviously I looked closely at the card and thought it was under graded, and they came back minimum bgs 8.5 and I’ve got a couple bgs 9’s. I’m still planning on doing that with my 1st edition charizard psa 8!
